Terrängbil 16 "Galten" Delserie 3

RycotSS · January 21, 2023

Terrängbil 16 "Galten" Delserie 3

Summary

Terrängbil 16 (shortened to Tgb 16), previously known as both Personterrängbil 6 and Pansarterrängbil 16 (shortened to Ptgb 6 and Patgb 16) but universally called “Galten” is a South African armoured car in Swedish service where it performs the role of a troop transport in a similar way to the American Humvee. Whilst this type of vehicle may seem unnecessary in War Thunder, it can be fitted with weapons that makes it a viable addition. The "Delserie 3" specifies it as the third batch of vehicles ordered / delivered.

History

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The Swedish military police were in need of an armoured vehicle as they previously had been using unarmoured Volkswagen vans. At the same time, there was a need for a mine-resistant armoured vehicle for a planned operation in the western Sahara. In 2002 as a team from Försvarets materielverk (FMV) searched the scarce market for a vehicle which fit both of those requirements they found a vehicle used by the South African police known as the “Mamba” produced by BAE Land Systems OMC. The team then went down to South Africa to take a look at this vehicle which led them to discovering the RG-32 Scout which was also produced by BAE Land Systems OMC. During this visit the RG-32 Scout was subsequently chosen as the vehicle which would be procured. During this visit in South Africa, the team from FMV then visited a pub where the nickname “Galten” was formed for the vehicle.

The first batch (Delserie 1) of the Terrängbil 16 was ordered in 2005 where a total of 102 vehicles were ordered where it received the name “Personterrängbil 6 pass 4x4 diesel splitterskyddad/T” or simply Personterrängbil 6. These vehicles were however only provided with a simple unarmoured pintle-mount for the gunner when it was already known as a bad idea to have unprotected gunners from the Swedish experience gained in the Balkans with the Pansarterrängbil 180.

Terrängbil 16 Delserie 1

During all of this, the Swedish operations in Afghanistan under the ISAF were taking place and Swedish soldiers were getting shot at more. This lead the chief of planning at Försvarsmakten, Berndt Grundevik, to make requests to send armoured equipment down to Afghanistan. This in turn led to the Stridsfordon 9040C and Terrängbil 16 being sent to complement and replace the current vehicle in use, the Toyota Land Rover.

Due to the aforementioned experience in the Balkans and the increasing danger placed on Swedish soldiers, an armoured cover was designed for the gunner. However the added weight and higher centre of gravity meant that the vehicle required another modification. This was solved in the second batch of Terrängbil 16 (Delserie 2) that was ordered in 2008 and contained 98 vehicles which as a result of the upgrades had a reduced top-speed from 120 km/h to 110 km/h and an increased weight from 6920 kg to 7885 kg.

Terrängbil 16 Delserie 2

Whilst delserie 2 gave a huge improvement in the safety for the gunner of the Terrängbil 16, it could still be improved. When the 22nd unit of the Swedish operations in Afghanistan, FS 22, arrived in December 2011 they had a new weapons system mounted on the roofs of their Terrängbil 16s, the Vapenation 01. This is the Swedish designation for the Protector Nordic / Protector RS4 / CROWS2 remote weapons station produced by the Norwegian company Kongsberg. This new RWS was equipped with a thermal imager, laser rangefinder, could fit multiple different weapons and was controlled from the inside of the vehicle giving the best possible protection for the gunner. Every vehicle in delserie 2 was eventually upgraded with the Vapenstation 01 which in the third batch, Delserie 3 which was ordered in 2009 and contained 60 vehicles, now had all of these upgrades from the experiences in Afghanistan on them as they left the factory door.

Terrängbil 16 Delserie 3 with Kulspruta 58 in Vapenstation 01

Features

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Armaments

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The Terrängbil 16 Delserie 3 is fitted with the Vapenstaion 01 RWS which is produced by the Norwegian company Kongsberg under the name Protector RS4. This system is fitted with a thermal imager, laser rangefinder, dual-axis stabilisation and IRST. The weapons which can be fitted into the Vapenstaion 01 are the Granatspruta 92 (Grsp 92, Swedish designation for the SACO Defense Mark 19 Mod 3), Kulspruta 88 (Ksp 88, Swedish designation for the FN M2HB-QCB), Kulspruta 58 (Ksp 58, Swedish designation for the FN MAG) and the Kulspruta 90 (Ksp 90, Swedish designation for the FN MINIMI).

Vapenstation 01 fitted with Kulspruta 58

Hull

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The hull of the Terrängbil 16 Delserie 3 is the South African 4x4 named RG32M produced by BAE Land Systems OMC which in turn is the military version of the RG32 Scout. It is rated as STANAG Level 1 in its base form but add-on armour exists for it which increases its protection to STANAG Level 2. The general construction of the vehicle also makes it highly resistant against troop mines and IEDs. The combination of this and a Central Tire Inflation System (CTIS) makes this vehicle surprisingly resilient for what it is. It also features outstanding mobility due to its lightweight construction yet powerful engine and transmission.

Barracuda MCS

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During the deployment of the Terrängbil 16 in Afghanistan and Mali, a large number were fitted with the Barracuda MCS multispectral camouflage to reduce, among others, the thermal signature of the vehicles by Taliban and al-Qaida thermal imagers. Due to this it would be possible to add Barracuda MCS as a modification for this vehicle. It would be of questionable effect in game as it would be unlikely for this vehicle to encounter any other thermal imagers, or at least they would be very rare.

Terrängbil 16 in Mali

In War Thunder

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I see two ways that the Terrängbil 16 Delserie 3 can fit into War Thunder right now.

A low-medium BR (4.7 - 5.7 ish) SPAA featuring only a single machine gun (Ksp 88, Ksp 58 or Ksp 90) where it would have trouble penetrating anything above light tanks or other SPAA (especially if it’s implemented without the Ksp 88). As such, this thing would not be a huge threat to other ground elements unless they are so lightly armoured that anything can kill them. It would however have a dual-axis stabiliser, thermal imaging and IRST which would, despite its lacking firepower, let it shoot down planes. It would force the player to aim for weak spots of planes (such as the pilot or engine) as they will only get a few rounds on target due to the lack of volume of fire that other SPAA in this battlerating have. Furthermore high-altitude planes are completely immune to this vehicle due it being a single MG. Gaijin could possibly even omit the lead indicator to further nerf it if it turns out to be able to shoot down planes too easily. To summarise you would have a highly mobile SPAA with an extremely good FCS, yet a very low firepower to compensate for the amazing tech.

A medium BR (6.3 - 7.0 ish) armoured car armed with the Grsp 92. It would not be able to shoot down planes unless at extremely close ranges even if it can lock onto them due to the low velocity of the 40 PSGR but would however be able to penetrate the sides of most medium tanks, and possibly some heavy tanks when aiming at weak spots. It would however have awful post-pen damage due to it being low-calibre HEDP and would struggle to overpressure anything other than a truck. The stabiliser, thermal imaging, laser rangefinder and amazing mobility would however make up for that by letting you flank to hit those weak spots. To summarise you would have a highly mobile armoured car with extremely good FCS but you would go up against a lot of heavy tanks who you will struggle to penetrate unless you are aiming for weak spots, and even when penetrating a target, your post-pen damage would be small potentially forcing you to hit the same spot multiple times to as an example take out an engine or detonate some ammo. You would be able to disable the things you can't penetrate, but you would need help from team mates to actually kill them. Think of it as a sort of wheeled Wiesel 1A4, but with the apaches gun (although slightly higher penetration than the apache) and a stabiliser.

Specifications

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General:

Crew: 2
- Driver
- Commander / Gunner
Weight: 7885 kg
Height: 2,8 m
Width: 2,21 m
Length: 5,05 m (5,32 m with reserve tire on the back)
Ground clearance: 437 mm
Wheelbase: 2,9 m
Protection: STANAG Level 1

Mobility:

Top speed: 110 km/h
Gradient: 30,96°
Side slope: 21,8°
Fording: 0,8 m
Vertical obstacle: 0,35 m
Turning radius: 17 m
Trench: 0,5 m
Engine:
- Steyr-Daimler-Puch M16 3,2l 6-cylinder:
  - 181 hp at 3800 rpm
  - 215 hp at 4000 rpm without VEC (Vehicle Emissions Control)
  - 420 Nm at 1800 rpm
Transmission:
- Allison 1000 SP:
  - Automatic
  - 5 forward gears
  - 1 reverse gear
CTIS which lets the vehicle keep running for up to a kilometre with one or more tires punctured.

Armaments:

Vapenstation 01
- Weight (excluding weapon and magazine): 135 - 190 kg
- Horizontal traverse:
  - 360° coverage
  - 90°/s rotation speed
- Vertical traverse:
  - -20° gun depression
  - +60° gun elevation
  - 70°/s rotation speed
- Dual axis stabilisation
- Laser rangefinder
- Thermal sight
- IRST
- Automatic lead angle correction
- Weapons:
  - Granatspruta 92:
    Spoiler
    Calibre: 40 x 53 mm
    
    Weight: 39 kg
    
    Length: 1095 mm
    
    Fire-rate: 350 rpm
    
    Magazine size: 32 rounds
    
    Magazine weight: 19 kg
    
    Ammunition:
    
    40 Pansarspränggranat / 40 PSGR (HEDP)
    
    Muzzle velocity: 241 m/s
    
    Weight: 0,34 kg
    
    Projectile weight: 0,25 kg
    
    Explosive type: Composition CH-6
    
    Explosive mass: 33 g
    
    Penetration: ~ 50 - 70 mm RHA
    
    Automatic detonation after ~ 15 seconds
    
    Fuze type: Contact fuze
  - Kulspruta 88:
    Spoiler
    Calibre: 12,7 x 99 mm
    
    Weight: 38 kg
    
    Length: 1650 mm
    
    Fire-rate: 450 - 650 rpm
    
    Magazine size: 100 rounds
    
    Magazine weight: 16 kg
    
    Ammunition:
    
    Normalprojektil / NPRJ (Normal bullet):
    
    Muzzle velocity: 920 m/s
    
    Weight: 0,114 kg
    
    Projectile weight: 43 g
    
    Propellant: CBC 127
    
    Propellant weight: 15,5 g
    
    Spårljusprojektil / SLPRJ (T):
    
    Muzzle velocity: unknown (probably 920 or 925 m/s)
    
    Weight: 0,112 kg
    
    Projectile weight: 41 g
    
    Propellant: CBC 127
    
    Propellant weight: 15 g
    
    Tracer distance: ~1500 m
    
    Brandsprängprojektil / BRSPRJ (HE-I):
    
    Muzzle velocity: 925 m/s
    
    Weight: 0,114 kg
    
    Projectile weight: 43 g
    
    Propellant: NC 167
    
    Propellant weight: 15 g
    
    Spårljusbrandsprängprojektil / SLBRSPRJ (HEI-T):
    
    Muzzle velocity: 925 m/s
    
    Weight: 0,115 kg
    
    Projectile weight: 44 g
    
    Propellant: NC 167
    
    Propellant weight: 15 g
    
    Tracer distance: 1500 m
    
    Belts:
    
    NBAND:
    
    NPRJ / NPRJ / NPRJ / NPRJ
    
    SLNBAND:
    
    NPRJ / SLPRJ / NPRJ / SLPRJ
    
    SLNBAND 4+1:
    
    NPRJ / NPRJ / NPRJ / NPRJ / SLPRJ
    
    SLBRSPRJBAND:
    
    BRSPRJ / SLBRSPRJ / BRSPRJ / SLBRSPRJ
    
    SLBRSPRJBAND 4+1:
    
    BRSPRJ / BRSPRJ / BRSPRJ / BRSPRJ / SLBRSPRJ
  - Kulspruta 58:
    Spoiler
    Calibre: 7,62 x 51 mm NATO
    
    Weight: 11,5 kg
    
    Length: 1275 mm
    
    Fire-rate: 600 - 700 rpm
    
    Magazine size: 249 rounds
    
    Magazine weight: 13 kg
    
    Ammunition:
    
    Skarpprojektil / PRJ (Normal bullet)
    
    Muzzle velocity: 820 m/s
    
    Weight: 23,8 g
    
    Projectile weight: 9,5 g
    
    Propellant: NC1055
    
    Propellant weight: 2,7 g
    
    Stålkärneprojektil / STKPRJ (SAP) *
    
    Muzzle velocity: 820 m/s
    
    Weight: 23,5 g
    
    Projectile weight: 9,5 g
    
    Propellant: NC1331
    
    Propellant weight: 2,75 g
    
    Spårljusprojektil 7,62/10B / SLPRJ (T)
    
    Muzzle velocity: 870 m/s
    
    Weight: 23,8 g
    
    Projectile weight: 9,1 g
    
    Propellant: NC1331
    
    Propellant weight: 2,63 g
    
    Tracer distance: >775 m
    
    Spårljusprojektil 7,62/10 / SLPRJ (T)
    
    Muzzle velocity: 775 m/s
    
    Weight: 23,8 g
    
    Projectile weight: 9,1 g
    
    Propellant: NC1055
    
    Propellant weight: 2,7 g
    
    Tracer distance: >775 m
    
    Pansarbrytandeprojektil / PPRJ (AP)
    
    Muzzle velocity: 880 m/s
    
    Weight: 24 g
    
    Projectile weight: 9,4 g
    
    Propellant: NC1290
    
    Propellant weight: 2,9 g
    
    Penetration: 18 mm of RHA at 100 m
    
    IR-Spårljusprojektil / IR-SLPRJ (IR-T)
    
    Muzzle velocity: unknown
    
    Weight: 23,5 g
    
    Projectile weight: 8,5 g
    
    Propellant: unknown
    
    Propellant weight: 2,7 g
    
    Tracer range: unknown
    
    Belts:
    
    NBAND10 M13:
    
    PRJ / PRJ / PRJ / PRJ / PRJ / PRJ
    
    NBAND10B M13:
    
    STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ
    
    SLBAND10 M13: **
    
    SLPRJ / SLPRJ / SLPRJ / SLPRJ
    
    SLNBAND10 M13: ***
    
    SLPRJ / PRJ / PRJ / SLPRJ / PRJ / PRJ
    
    SLNBAND10B M13: ***
    
    PRJ / SLPRJ / PRJ / PRJ / PRJ / SLPRJ
    
    SLNBAND10 KSP58: **
    
    SLPRJ / PRJ / PRJ / SLPRJ / PRJ / PRJ
    
    IR-SLNBAND M13:
    
    STKPRJ / IR-SLPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / IR-SLPRJ
    
    IRPPRJBAND M13:
    
    PPRJ / IR-SLPRJ / PPRJ / PPRJ / PPRJ / IR-SLPRJ
    
    * STKPRJ is just like PRJ but with a steel tip for increased penetration hence why I marked it as SAP.
    
    ** Uses the Spårljusprojektil 7,62/10 .
    
    *** Uses the Spårljusprojektil 7,62/10B.
  - Kulspruta 90:
    Spoiler
    Calibre: 5,56 x 45 mm NATO
    
    Weight: 7 kg
    
    Length: 1040 mm
    
    Fire-rate: 800 rpm
    
    Magazine size: 200 rounds
    
    Magazine weight: 3 kg
    
    Ammunition:
    
    Stålkärneprojektil 5,56/5B / STKPRJ (SAP) *
    
    Muzzle velocity: 855 m/s
    
    Weight: 12,2 g
    
    Projectile weight: 4 g
    
    Propellant: SMP 842
    
    Propellant weight: 1,7 g
    
    Stålkärneprojektil 5,56/5 / STKPRJ (SAP) *
    
    Muzzle velocity: 855 m/s
    
    Weight: 12,5 g
    
    Projectile weight: 4 g
    
    Propellant: NC1274
    
    Propellant weight: 1,5 g
    
    Spårljusprojektil / SLPRJ (T)
    
    Muzzle velocity: 850 m/s
    
    Weight: 12,5 g
    
    Projectile weight: 3,9 g
    
    Propellant: SMP 842
    
    Propellant weight: 1,7 g
    
    Tracer distance: >600 m
    
    IR-Spårljusprojektil / IR-SLPRJ (IR-T)
    
    Muzzle velocity: 880 m/s
    
    Weight: 12,5 g
    
    Projectile weight: 3,9 g
    
    Propellant: WCR 845
    
    Propellant weight: 1,67 g
    
    Tracer distance: >600 m
    
    Belts:
    
    SK PTR 5 NBAND: **
    
    STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ
    
    SKPTR 5B NBAND: ***
    
    STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ
    
    SLNBAND:
    
    STKPRJ / SLPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / SLPRJ
    
    IR-SLNBAND:
    
    STKPRJ / IR-SLPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / STKPRJ / IR-SLPRJ
    
    * STKPRJ same as in the case of the Ksp 58 hence why I marked it as SAP.
    
    ** Uses the Stålkärneprojektil 5,56/5.
    
    *** Uses the Stålkärneprojektil 5,56/5B.
- Total ammo count:
  - With Granatspruta 92: unknown
  - With Kulspruta 88: unknown
  - With Kulspruta 58: 8 magazines (1600 rounds in total)
  - With Kulspruta 90: unknown
  - Possible that the standard is 8 magazines for the gun regardless of what gun is mounted in the Vapenstation 01.

Sources

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Försvarets materielverk (FMV). M7779-002095 / Ammunitionskatalog : data och bild. 2014.

Proof of declassification:

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LIBRIS is the library database run by Kungliga biblioteket, the National Library of Sweden, where every available publication in Swedish libraries is shown.

https://libris.kb.se/bib/17803246?vw=full&tab2=subj

Riksarkivet, the National Archives of Sweden, is the state ministry responsible for archiving material published within Sweden.

https://riksarkivet.mikromarc.se/Mikromarc3/detail.aspx?Unit=6487&db=riksarkivet&Id=348692&SW=ammunitionskatalog%&SC=FT&LB=FT&MT=0&SU=6563&DG=10&ST=Normal&Browse=1&P=1

Försvarsmaktens biblioteksportal which is endorsed by Försvarsmakten in a blog post on their website. (https://blogg.forsvarsmakten.se/fmlope/publikationer/)

https://forsvarsmakten-sverige.mikromarc.se/mikromarc3/detail.aspx?Unit=13424&db=forsvarsmakten-sverige&Id=82914&SW=ammunitionskatalog%&SC=FT&LB=FT&MT=0&SU=13428&DG=0&ST=Normal&Browse=1&P=1

The three of these show M7779-002095 / the 2014 publication of “Ammunitionskatalog : data och bild” to be a publicly available document which can be loaned at the "Krigsarkivet" archive located in Täby, Stockholm and at "Sjöstridsskolans bibliotek" library located in Karlskrona.

Bodhal, Martin. Band eller hjul? Lämpligt fordon för EOD-specifika behov i Afghanistan. Fältarbetsskolan. 2009-03-02.

http://www.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:236425/FULLTEXT01.pdf

Petterson, Mikael. Erfarenheter av forcerad materielförsörjning av Vapensystem 01. Försvarshögskolan. 2012-06-07.

http://fhs.diva-portal.org/smash/get/diva2:541327/FULLTEXT01.pdf

Personterrängbil 6

Specifications and History Terrängbil 16 Delserie 3

History Terrängbil 16 Delserie 3

Specifications Terrängbil 16 Delserie 3

Specifications Vapenstation 01

History and Specifications Vapenstation 01

Specifications Granatspruta 92

Specifications Kulspruta 88

Specifications Kulspruta 58

Specifications Kulspruta 90

Additional images / videos

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Kongsberg demonstration of a SACO Defense Mk 19 fitted onto a Protector RS4 which shows a bit of the FCS. (Note. Granatspruta 92 doesn't use air-burst ammunition like the ones in the demonstration)

Under the hood of the Terrängbil 16

Drivers seat of the Terrängbil 16

General description of the items related to operating the Vapenstation 01

Edited February 20, 2023 by RycotSS
Formatting.

Miki_Hoshii · February 7, 2023

Open for discussion

RycotSS · February 7, 2023

26 minutes ago, Miki_Hoshii said:

Open for discussion

Thank you! :salute:

DMYEugen · February 7, 2023

I'm gonna give it a +1 for both of your proposed applications, however, I can definitely see some and expect extreme pushback here since it'd be the most modern vehicle, to date, going head to head with WW2 and early Cold War vehicles.

I like the 40mm especially since it could certainly work at 7.3 with its high speed and stabilizer. It would have no issue getting in close enough to spam 70mm penning grenades into the sides of lighter vehicles if played with a brain.

Edited February 9, 2023 by DMYEugen

AspandaIV · February 8, 2023

The only way i'll support this is if it carries an ATGM, AAM (maybe be able to carry both), Recoilless rifle and/or a Autocannon and also specifiy which ATGM's, AAM's, Recoilless rifles and Autocannons it can equip

Edited February 8, 2023 by AspandaIV

SaabGripen · February 8, 2023

Sorry for -1 but I don't want to see this vehicle alongside the early WW2 vehicles.

RycotSS · February 8, 2023

10 hours ago, SaabGripen said:

Sorry for -1 but I don't want to see this vehicle alongside the early WW2 vehicles.

Yeah that is the problem with this vehicle. It can be balanced in the game but it would face vehicles from early - mid ww2 or late ww2 - early cold war to be balanced.

G1label · February 8, 2023

-1 this seems a bit to much of a stretch to add imo. A single low velocity 40mm and an mg would make this thing kinda bad at any br.

DMYEugen · February 8, 2023

16 minutes ago, G1label said:

-1 this seems a bit to much of a stretch to add imo. A single low velocity 40mm and an mg would make this thing kinda bad at any br.

Disagree. Yes, it's a low velocity 40mm grenade launcher, however, it is mounted on an incredibly mobile wheeled platform, which have proven time and time again to be easily capable of not only getting close enough but also outrunning the traverse of most turrets. In situations like these, the low velocity of the 40mm is irrelevant and up to 70mm of penetration is nothing to sneeze at. Let's not forget that it is stabilized as well.

I can understand not wanting it to be added due to it being too modern for its potential BR, however, it would absolutely not be a bad vehicle.

G1label · February 8, 2023

13 minutes ago, DMYEugen said:

Disagree. Yes, it's a low velocity 40mm grenade launcher, however, it is mounted on an incredibly mobile wheeled platform, which have proven time and time again to be easily capable of not only getting close enough but also outrunning the traverse of most turrets. In situations like these, the low velocity of the 40mm is irrelevant and up to 70mm of penetration is nothing to sneeze at. Let's not forget that it is stabilized as well.

I can understand not wanting it to be added due to it being too modern for its potential BR, however, it would absolutely not be a bad vehicle.

Well my issue is that it can't reasonably be placed at a br where it wouldn't look out of place. It's to bad for anywhere above like 4.3 or something.

DMYEugen · February 8, 2023

2 minutes ago, G1label said:

Well my issue is that it can't reasonably be placed at a br where it wouldn't look out of place. It's to bad for anywhere above like 4.3 or something.

Again, I disagree. It think it could function reasonably well all the way up until composite and ERA become commonplace due to, again, its incredible mobility, stabilizer, and reasonable penetration. It'd be an incredible scout/counter-scout and rapid fire 40mm grenades would shred barrels and tracks.

I agree that it'd be out of place, but high speed and a stabilizer could easily make up for the low velocity if played to its strengths.

G1label · February 8, 2023

5 minutes ago, DMYEugen said:

Again, I disagree. It think it could function reasonably well all the way up until composite and ERA become commonplace due to, again, its incredible mobility, stabilizer, and reasonable penetration. It'd be an incredible scout/counter-scout and rapid fire 40mm grenades would shred barrels and tracks.

I agree that it'd be out of place, but high speed and a stabilizer could easily make up for the low velocity if played to its strengths.

I guess it's would be hard to judge as of now. There isn't really a vehicle like this in game currently. The closest thing you could compare it to is the r3 but that has a higher velocity gun and is more ment for aa use.

DMYEugen · February 8, 2023

14 minutes ago, G1label said:

I guess it's would be hard to judge as of now. There isn't really a vehicle like this in game currently. The closest thing you could compare it to is the r3 but that has a higher velocity gun and is more ment for aa use.

Agreed, though I think a better comparison would be the Type 87 RCV as it was initially 7.3 with 93mm of max penetration and no stabilizer yet it was still objectively a monster. Still a higher velocity gun, however, it still needed to get in close to actually penetrate anything and its lack of stabilizer made it necessary to occasionally stop. If placed at a similar BR, this vehicle would be capable of defeating most light and medium targets when using a slightly modified version of the RCV's former playstyle.

Edited February 8, 2023 by DMYEugen

McPuff · February 9, 2023

Well written suggestion, but I can't support it in this form as I don't really see how such a light armament could work in WT.

There is however another more suitable variant, one fitted with the Lemur 30 RWS developed by BAE/Bofors. The 30 mm M230, which could in theory use airburst ammunition besides HEDP, would be far more suitable for WT. Same setup was also tested on a Danish M113 and a CB90

Lemur | BAE Systems | International

Spr4yz · February 9, 2023

6 hours ago, McPuff said:

Well written suggestion, but I can't support it in this form as I don't really see how such a light armament could work in WT.

There is however another more suitable variant, one fitted with the Lemur 30 RWS developed by BAE/Bofors. The 30 mm M230, which could in theory use airburst ammunition besides HEDP, would be far more suitable for WT. Same setup was also tested on a Danish M113 and a CB90

I could support it in this version. A highly mobile 30mm autocannon with proxy/VT rounds would make it competitive at higher BRs.

Edited February 9, 2023 by Spr4yz

Wolf_89 · February 9, 2023

Sadly i hade to vote no. Mainly because of its low BR and usefulness.

But i would vote yes(as long as it wont get a low BR) for McPuffs verision. Since it has a 30mm. So it will be more useful.

G1label · February 10, 2023

On 09/02/2023 at 04:18, McPuff said:

Well written suggestion, but I can't support it in this form as I don't really see how such a light armament could work in WT.

There is however another more suitable variant, one fitted with the Lemur 30 RWS developed by BAE/Bofors. The 30 mm M230, which could in theory use airburst ammunition besides HEDP, would be far more suitable for WT. Same setup was also tested on a Danish M113 and a CB90

I would definitely support a suggestion on this version. It could actually help out with the spaag gap the Sweden currently has.

Edited February 10, 2023 by G1label

Lord_Prism · February 10, 2023

On 09/02/2023 at 04:18, McPuff said:

Well written suggestion, but I can't support it in this form as I don't really see how such a light armament could work in WT.

There is however another more suitable variant, one fitted with the Lemur 30 RWS developed by BAE/Bofors. The 30 mm M230, which could in theory use airburst ammunition besides HEDP, would be far more suitable for WT. Same setup was also tested on a Danish M113 and a CB90

This is a much better option, and keeps it up higher where a stabilized and thermal capable vehicle such as this would fit (and would open the door on armed trucks like this coming to the game)

AspandaIV · February 11, 2023

On 09/02/2023 at 22:18, McPuff said:

Well written suggestion, but I can't support it in this form as I don't really see how such a light armament could work in WT.

There is however another more suitable variant, one fitted with the Lemur 30 RWS developed by BAE/Bofors. The 30 mm M230, which could in theory use airburst ammunition besides HEDP, would be far more suitable for WT. Same setup was also tested on a Danish M113 and a CB90

I don't mind supporting this though since the autocannon has high enough pen to even pose a threat to modern MBT's and most if not all light AFV's

ArmyKris1 · February 11, 2023

On 09/02/2023 at 10:18, McPuff said:

Well written suggestion, but I can't support it in this form as I don't really see how such a light armament could work in WT.

There is however another more suitable variant, one fitted with the Lemur 30 RWS developed by BAE/Bofors. The 30 mm M230, which could in theory use airburst ammunition besides HEDP, would be far more suitable for WT. Same setup was also tested on a Danish M113 and a CB90

I would say this would be the best option tho if it gets added i hope it dosent become the R3 2.0

RycotSS · February 18, 2023

On 09/02/2023 at 10:18, McPuff said:

Well written suggestion, but I can't support it in this form as I don't really see how such a light armament could work in WT.

There is however another more suitable variant, one fitted with the Lemur 30 RWS developed by BAE/Bofors. The 30 mm M230, which could in theory use airburst ammunition besides HEDP, would be far more suitable for WT. Same setup was also tested on a Danish M113 and a CB90

On 09/02/2023 at 16:52, Spr4yz said:

I could support it in this version. A highly mobile 30mm autocannon with proxy/VT rounds would make it competitive at higher BRs.

On 10/02/2023 at 14:27, G1label said:

I would definitely support a suggestion on this version. It could actually help out with the spaag gap the Sweden currently has.

On 10/02/2023 at 14:55, Lord_Prism said:

This is a much better option, and keeps it up higher where a stabilized and thermal capable vehicle such as this would fit (and would open the door on armed trucks like this coming to the game)

On 11/02/2023 at 03:30, AspandaIV said:

I don't mind supporting this though since the autocannon has high enough pen to even pose a threat to modern MBT's and most if not all light AFV's

On 11/02/2023 at 21:31, ArmyKris1 said:

I would say this would be the best option tho if it gets added i hope it dosent become the R3 2.0

You ask and you shall recieve! :salute:

Berserker0011 · February 28, 2023

Why not have an AA version and an AT support version?

Terrängbil 16 "Galten" Delserie 3